Fronius activewave

[dobre]

The fronius ac/dc 2200 has what they call an activewave. Is this the same as a sinewave or double squarewave. It is said to be very quiet when in ac mode for aluminium. A lot of ac/dc tigs offer both squarewave and sinewave form, the first for better penatration and narrower weld bead but you have to put upo with load noise from it.

Dobre

[grumpy]

Hi Dobre,
I own the next model down a Fronius Magicwave 1700. It has the Activewave circuitry and is exceptionally quiet to use.

The unit has a shipload of very advanced technology right down to being able to shape the profile of the tungsten by the digital control of the arc.

Its mostly way above the knowledge of this old dinosaur. Every time I try something different on it it surprises me.

I welded 3mm mesh wire to 3mm mesh wire the other day at a wopping 32 amps.
Try something like that with a transformer welder.The initial arc surge explodes the wire .Kemppi is the only other brand that comes even close to Fronius in technology.

Wait until you see the plasma cutter my next purchase.It is so advanced, no compressed air or gas. Just water, mind you its special Fronius water.too much to tell here,the website explains it.

Merry xmas to all
Grumpy

[dobre]

Hi Grumpy, thanks for your reply but is the active wave similar to the sinewave and double squarewave or is it more superier than the other 2. The kemppi is a great machine from what i am hearing, some of it may be biased and some simply on performance and quality.
The fronius may have the edge on the kemppi with a few features but they are very close to each other and i think the price of the kemppi makes it a great buy. The kemppi (2300) is fairly easy to use compared to the fronius. The fronius is an excellent machine and at the top of the tree but us welders want something that is not to complicated to use and not waste time working out how to use something thats a bit tricky.Sometimes too much information is a bad thing. A bit like a mobile phones when a menu is too big with too many branches you get lost
very quickly

Dobre...............

[grumpy]

Hi Dobre
My bad habit is not reading all the post properly before I reply.
The sine wave is the original arc timing as seen on the scope over and below the neutral line, positive through the neutral line and back again at 50 hertz (least ways in Oz).The arc only achieved max power for a fraction of its time through the cycle and was regarded as inefficient.
My understanding of square wave is in the timing of the arc or how quickly the arc takes to reach its arc potential. The neutral line could then be adjusted up or down so the arc spent more time on positive or neutral as required.

The square wave is a speed increase on the sine wave spending most of its arc time either on positive or negative poles where as the sine wave (as in the older type non electronic tig welders )
Unfortunately the frequency timing created a hell of a racket- not that the choke machines were ever that quiet.

The active wave is an advance on that achieve by tuning the frequencies so the noise went away but also other benefits came to light.Remember they are up in multi thousand hertz where as the old machines hobbled along at 50 hertz.

I know we did go into it a bit deeper but it so long ago and has not been used often so it disappeared into the black hole that serves as my memory.Plus the fact that these innovations are a recent thing and for a while I had my eye off the ball so to speak.

Have a great chrissy.
Grumpy

[dobre]

I know that squarewave hits hard at the top and bottom of the cycle like a sledge hammer. This is an annoying noise to the ear and i guess there are pros and cons in all welding machines. With this active wave on the fronius does it limit what you can do with it?
Comparing it to the kemppi which offers you both options and is the fronius suited for certain industry. I have not used a fronius but have been to the distributers wharehouse here in Thomastown,melb and they do have a impressive set up. They do a lot of trade demos from there and also have their service dept and parts all under one roof. The md, Paul England is a great guy who took time to show me around. What i do like about the fronius is the auto ball set function.
I am keen to try the kemppi 2300 soon and see how it goes and with their marketing they are well priced in comparsion for a near equal type of machine. Fronius may have the edge because they are a great unit and with a large gap in price you begin to think twice

Dobre

[grumpy]

Dobre,
I pinched the following from the Fronious site and with the help of some editing have cut out most of the BS sales phrases.The description I think has been directly translated from Austrian language but it seems not by a welder as it seems too "flowery"-thats why I edited it as it did not all make sense.The bloody manual is like that too!

I know a local guy who is building up his business in sheet metal to a manufacturing level for the mine work. He has tried every type of TIG unit and settled at last on the Magicave 2200.He has the water cooled Fronius tig accessories so he can drive it as hard as he needs to on ali. He reckons he was not far away for robotic production and the 2200 will cater for this at a later stage with the accessories.

Heres is the info on Activewave

With the ActiveWave technology developed by Fronius, the integrated digital processor continuously calculates each working point, resulting in a combination of optimum arc stability and minimum noise emissions.
• The power curve generated by the energy source in real time results in a noise level below 80 dbA even at maximum power.
• For the user, this means a more exact "welding by ear" with a quieter and hence less stressful working environment.

The new machines provide a number of functions which result in large time savings for the user.
Resonant intelligence for stable MMA welding arc

An ideal characteristic leads to perfect welding results, and resonant intelligence can help welders achieve a stable arc with MMA welding

One of the major functions is the automatic ball formation of the electrode in only one second.
This can save up to one working week per year and employee! Other innovations include :
programs available at the push of a button
the possibility of 100 stored jobs set up specs,
for pulse, spot and tacking functions, or the easy operating concept.

This can save up to one working week per year and employee! Other innovations include programs available at the push of a button, the possibility of storing set up specs for 100 jobs, for pulse, spot
and tacking functions.

Another highlight is the "Jobmaster TIG" torch that puts all the functions directly into the welder's hand "on site".(Read ' digital display head on torch body 'Grumpy)

In accordance with the Fronius concept, a wide range of accessories are available for every application.For instance, various remote controls, torches, water cooling and also options such as networking with PC and robots.

The power curve generated by the energy source in real time results in a noise level below 80 dbA even at maximum power.

The ability to run from generators, combined with the 240 Volt outlet available practically everywhere, theses machines are the perfect welding tool for production, assembly

With conventional MMA welding machines, fluctuations in the mains voltage and mains cables of different lengths have a detrimental effect on the output power.
The same applies to changes in the arc length.
Fluctuations in the current then lead to changes in the arc, and in turn to poor quality welding results.

Such undesirable side effects are not an issue with resonant intelligence, even with cable lengths of 100 m.
So that sticking is avoided if there is a short circuit, the control briefly raises the current.
If the electrode threatens to sink into the weld pool, the increased current prevents the weld pool from solidifying.
This practically prevents the rod electrode from 'sticking'.
The welder can therefore also process cellulose electrodes up to 5 mm in diameter in vertical-down seam position.
This is barely possible with most conventional welding machines.
The prerequisite for resonant intelligence is the resonance inverter developed by Fronius.
It generates an interaction between welding transformer and capacitor.
In addition to the capacitors, the transformer also takes on the role of energy buffer.
Resonant here denotes a particular condition: Transformer and capacitors are matched in such a way that they reboot each other.

The cleverly devised combination of resonance and buffer function creates power reserves that are on hand if required by the arc.

Hope this helps give you a better insight to the machine operation.

Grumpy

[dobre]

Always a tough call when you narrow it down to 2 machines that in alot of ways are pretty close not that either manufacturer would agree to this. Ours is better than theirs, bla, bla bla. I guess you need to decide what you intend to do with the tig machine now and possibly in the future and they are both fairly expensive. If you are going to do high end critical welding i would reach out for the fronius but if you are in the mid range the kemppi would meet your needs very well.
I think i will be sitting on the fence for a little while before i make a decision and the good thing is i dont need the machine today or tomorrow but in the new year sometime i will have to bite the bullet. Maybe just get both of them and then i wont have to say i should have got the other one. Ha ha.

Dobre

[dobre]

Grumpy, can you share the word on what welding you are planning on doing when you ask for $ or 2 from from the Rudster, thus the reason for purchasing your new baby fronius 1700. You may need a hand in FNQ from someone down south. Dont eat much, just like to weld.

Dobre

[grumpy]

Hi Dobre,
Is n't it great the board has started to gain monumentum.A big welcome to all the new blokes and thanks to taking the time to correspond.
I am not sure on what you mean about the Rudster.
After all Kevin's a fellow Queenslander and said he was he to help!!!!!

To answer your question re the purchase of the Fronius. I am within a few years of my targeted retirement. I don't want to stop work entirely but would still like to have an income .
I am setting up a one man niche welding business. I am not interested in big stuff but what ever a man can carry in. It keeps the work in perspective
I am not getting any younger and would rather use brain than brawn. I am looking for those specialized markets in the small repair and fab sections mainly in cast iron,stainless and aluminium.

In ali there is a big fishing community up here with aluminum "tinny's" that will need modifications ,repairs and attachments for specialized fishing tasks.

The big local shops are not much interested in taking in small work and certainly not cast iron.Fortunately I have about thirty years of cast iron experience behind me in stick,oxy fusion welding, powder spray and am in the process of perfecting a specialized Tig repair technique on cast iron using a unique filler.

With my Fronius,tig. Kemppi mig ,my Chinese lathe and a miller and a plasma in tmy near future , I believe I can handle anything presented to me.
!
Thats the plan anyway.

Grumpy

[dobre]

Hi Grumpy, my reference to the'' $ or 2 from the rudster'', was about when you accept a pension from him for your retirement years and may there be many. I know that teaching does not pay that well unless you took the kids lunch money every day and invested it with compound interest over the last 30 odd years.. Hows this plan fit in with the wife or does she share your vision as well. I guess she should be happy that you will be at home and if she wants to see you she can make her down to the shed.
Getting back to the nich welding business, i think that your right and it should keep you busy rather than sitting on ya bum wondering what to do with yourself.
Dobre

[grumpy]

Hi Dobre
I have super and have been paying into it since 1980.It is a crock and I advise all younger people to look at alternate wealth creation. Foolishly we trusted in the system to do the right thing by us. Both wife and I can only afford to live 10 years or so after we retire. I have restructured my income to generate enough to live on by our retirement target date. Thats why I am building up my business and tools as a slow process and I'll be able to ease into my new self employment by the time I retire.

Did you know that many secondary teachers die within ten years of retirement.? The rate among deputies and principals is higher again from the studies I saw. Its all about stress, unresolved stress and having to toe the line and follow political correctness.

If I don't stay employed in the next few years ,this will be the cause. I am not politically correct. Don't get me wrong ,I'll give 100% for the kids that try. For the rrrsoles that won't try I give them and their parents curry until they change or leave.

I'll have get of my soapbox ,I am starting to get dizzy up here.
Cheers
Grumpy